Chapter 6: Baking meat or dairy bread

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Chapter 6: Baking meat or dairy bread

 Introduction:

This chapter introduces a new but related subject of mixture prevention. Being that we eat both meat and milk meals, often on the same day, certain precautions must be taken to prevent dairy foods from being eaten with meat or vice versa. What foods can we possibly worry about that may come to be used for an opposite meal? Bread. Bread is considered the staple of a meal, and is often shared for both meat and dairy meals. Now, if a bread has become dairy or meaty, it is possible that one may come to eat it with the opposite food. Thus, this chapter is dedicated to discussing the limitations and regulations set by the Sages with regards to baking dairy or meaty bread and other products, as part of their efforts in mixture prevention.

1. Baking dairy or meaty bread:[1]

It is forbidden to knead dough with dairy or meat products [with exception to the cases mentioned below in B].[2] [This applies even to poultry and wild animal meat products.[3] Thus, one may not knead dough with milk, butter, meat gravy, chicken gravy, or other dairy or meat product.]

Bedieved if one baked meaty or dairy bread:[4] If one kneaded dough with milk or meat and then baked[5] it [without fulfilling one of the exceptions to be listed] the bread is forbidden to be eaten [although it may be sold to a gentile[6]]. It may not be eaten even on its own.[7] [This applies even if one did so Beshogeg/inadvertently, without prior knowledge of the prohibition, or if the milk accidently spilled into the dough.[8] Some Poskim, however, rule that even after the bread is baked one can perform one of the to be mentioned exceptions to the bread, and hence allow it to be eaten. See Q&A for the full details of this matter!]

2. Cases of exception and allowance:[9]

In the following cases, it is permitted to knead dough together with dairy or meat products:

  1. Small amount of bread which will only suffice for one meal: It is permitted to bake a small amount of dairy or meaty bread which will be eaten [by one’s entire household[10]] in one time.[11] [Some Poskim[12] define this to mean that the bread will be eaten within one meal. Other Poskim[13] define this to mean that it will be eaten within one day. Practically, the Ashkenazi ruling follows the latter opinion while the Sephardic ruling follows the former approach.[14]] Accordingly, it is accustomed [amongst Ashkenazim] to knead bread with milk for the Shavuos holiday, and to knead bread with fat for Shabbos, as this is considered a small amount, in addition to the fact that their shape is different, as explained next.[15] [If the bread is not baked in a special recognizable shape, then one must be careful to only bake a small amount, enough for one Shabbos.[16]]
  2. Making the bread into a shape which reminds one of its Kashrus status:[17] It is permitted to bake dairy or meaty bread which is shaped in a way that reminds one of its status of being dairy or meaty. [This shape must be formed prior to the baking. If one baked the bread without making a special shape as a reminder, the bread is forbidden to be eaten, and it no longer suffices to make a reminder after the baking.[18] However, if the bread is not yet fully baked, one may still form the shape as a reminders.[19]] Accordingly, it is accustomed to knead bread with fat for Shabbos, as the bread contains a special shape.[20] [It is for this reason that the bread for Shabbos is shaped into a braid, as the braid serves as a sign that it cannot be eaten with meat.[21] However, today that people no longer connect this shape as a sign for the above, one must be careful to only bake a small amount, enough for one Shabbos, as explained above.] Likewise, the dairy pastry called Pladin, and meat casserole called Pashtida, is permitted to be baked, [as they all have unique shapes[22]].[23]

Summary:

It is forbidden to knead dough with dairy or meat products, and if one did so the bread is forbidden to be eaten, unless the bread was formed into a specific shape as a reminder, or one baked a small amount that will suffice for only one day.

 

Q&A

May one bake dairy/meat bread for the sake of selling it to gentiles?[24]

It is initially forbidden to bake dairy/meaty bread even for the sake of selling to gentiles, as the gentile may in turn sell it to a Jew. However, Bedieved if one already baked the bread, it is permitted to sell the bread to a gentile.[25]

 

Q&A on absorbing milk/meat

If milk or meat spilled on one’s bread, is the bread forbidden to be eaten?[26]

The above prohibition only applies towards kneading and baking dairy/meaty bread. However, once the bread is baked, it remains permitted to be eaten even if it absorbed dairy/meat after the baking. However, if one will not be able to consume all the bread in one day, he is to make a sign on the bread as a reminder that it is dairy/meaty. If this is not possible, it is best to distribute the bread to one’s neighbors to be eaten that day rather than set it aside and possibly forget and come to eat the bread with the opposite food.

 

What is the law if milk spilled onto grains?[27]

The grains have a dairy status and hence may only be ground and used for baking products that have a special shape or are a minute amount.

 

What is the law if the bread or dough absorbed dairy taste through touching a Ben Yomo dairy vessel?[28]

The bread remains permitted.[29] See Chapter 4 Halacha 2 regarding if one may eat this bread with the opposite food.

 

What is the law if bread or dough absorbed dairy taste through touching a food that absorbed dairy?[30]

If while baking bread, the bread touched a potato that was cooked in a stew, nevertheless the bread remains permitted. However, it may not be eaten together with dairy.[31]

 

Q&A on other food products

Does the above decree against making meaty or dairy bread apply to other foods?

Bakery products:[32] The above decree applies to all bakery products that are eaten with other foods, and not just to bread.[33] Thus, pastries, borekas, biscuits, crackers, pretzels and the like may not be kneaded with dairy/meat unless they are made into a special shape that reminds one of their status. Their general shape [which is different than bread] does not suffice in this regard, as that is how they are baked, and people assume that they are Pareve.[34] However, those bakery products which are not commonly eaten with meat or milk, such as due to sweetness and the like, are not subject to the decree and may be kneaded with meat/milk.[35] [Practically, the custom of Hashgacha companies today is to require all dairy pastries to carry a triangle or moon shape.[36] While Pareve pastries carry a square or rectangle shape.]

Other foods-Spices; Wine: Some Poskim[37] rule that the above decree applies to any food that is commonly used for both meat and milk, such as spices.[38] Thus, one may not grind spices in a meat or dairy grinder and if one did so the spices are forbidden to be eaten even with Pareve. Likewise, one may not add milk to wine, being it is common to drink wine during meat meals.[39] Other Poskim[40], however, rule that the decree does not apply to any food other than bread [or Mezonos baked products], and hence it is permitted to grind spices in a meat/dairy grinder to eat with that type of food.[41]

 

Q&A on the exceptions

If the milk or meat is recognizable on the dough may they be kneaded together?[42]

The above prohibition against kneading dough with meat gravy, or dairy, only applies if the milk/meat is a minute amount and not recognizable to the onlooker. If, however, the amount is so great that it is recognizable on the dough itself, on the exterior of the product, then it is permitted to be [baked and] eaten.[43] Thus, one may knead dough with dairy or meaty products if he sprinkles cheese or meat on it, thus making it recognizable.

 

May one knead Pizza dough with milk?

Yes, as the cheese which is on it makes it evident to all that it cannot be eaten with meat.

 

If one baked a small amount of milky bread for one day’s worth and then had leftovers, may those leftovers be eaten?[44]

No. The bread must be thrown out, unless it contains a special shape as a reminder.

 

May one sell or distribute dairy or meaty bread which he formed into a specific shape?[45]

Making a shape on the dairy/meaty bread only helps to allow one’s family to eat the bread, however, it may not be distributed to the public which is unaware of the meaning of the shape.[46] This applies even if one tells the people of the dairy/meat status of the bread. However, if the shape is a sign well known to the people of the city, then it is permitted to be distributed to them. However, even in such a case, one is not to sell it in public, as the visitors may not be aware of the intent of the shape. Nonetheless, Bedieved, if one already baked the dairy/meaty bread with intent to sell, he may do so if he tells the visiting buyers of their meat/dairy status.[47]

If the meat/dairy taste is clearly felt in the bread:[48] The above only applies if the meat/dairy substance cannot be tasted in the bread. If, however, anyone who eats it can taste the meat/dairy that it contains, then it is permitted to sell it to the public with a special shape, even though there may be visitors who are unaware of the shapes intent.    

 

Q&A on 60x

If one kneaded bread with a very minute amount of milk/meat to the point that it is nullified in 60x, may the bread be eaten?[49]

The above prohibition to eat the dairy/meat bread only applies if the taste of meat or dairy can be felt in the bread. If, however, the added milk or meat gravy is nullified in 60x, then it is permitted to be eaten plain or even with meat/milk. This, however, only applies Bedieved after the mixture has already occurred, while Lechatchila one is to avoid doing so, as explained next!

 

May one initially knead a small ratio of meat or milk into the dough to the point there is 60x against it?

Some Poskim[50] rule it is forbidden to initially knead the dough with meat/milk [without fulfilling the above-mentioned conditions] even if the meat/milk is nullified in 60x and one plans to eat the bread plain. Other Poskim[51], however, rule that it is even initially permitted to do so if one does not intend to eat it with the opposite food. Practically, we rule like the first opinion. However, if one transgressed and did so, then the bread remains permitted to be eaten a stated in the previous Q&A.[52]

 

Q&A on Bedieved

If one baked a lot of bread without a shape or sign, may the sign be made after the baking?[53]

The bread must be shaped prior to the baking. If one already baked the bread, the bread is forbidden to be eaten and it no longer suffices to make the shape.[54] However, some Poskim[55] rule one may carve the word “Milk” on the bread even after the baking. Others[56] rule that in a case of great loss one may place labels on the bread. In all cases that if the bread is not yet fully baked, one may still form the shape to save it from prohibition.[57]

If one baked a lot of bread without a shape or sign, may one distribute the bread to many people, hence making it be one days’ worth?

Some Poskim[58] rule that if one baked more than one day’s worth of dairy/meaty bread without a shape/sign, then although it is forbidden for one to keep the bread for himself to eat, one may distribute the loaves to many families, in amounts that each family will finish the bread in one day. This causes the bread to now be considered “a day’s worth”, which is permitted to be eaten even if dairy or meaty. In such a case, one may even keep for himself enough bread for one day’s worth of meals. Other Poskim[59], however, negate this allowance, and rule that the entire mixture of breads are forbidden and must be discarded. Practically, one is not to rely on this allowance unless it is a case of great loss, in which case one may make a sign on the bread and distribute it to many families so it all be eaten in one day.[60] Likewise, one may rely on the above leniency [to make a shape and distribute] if one was not aware of the prohibition, or the milk fell in without one’s knowledge.[61]

If forbidden dairy/meaty bread became mixed with Pareve bread, what is the law of the mixture?[62]

The entire mixture is forbidden to be eaten, although in such a case, one may distribute the mixture to many people, to the point that it will not last more than one day by any one person.

3. Baking bread and meat or cheese simultaneously in the same oven:

Introduction: There are three Halachic issues involved in baking bread with meat or milk in the same oven. The first and main issue is the suspicion of spillage and contact. If the meat or milk spills and contacts the bread the bread becomes meaty or dairy and is forbidden to be eaten with the opposite food. This gives this bread the same status of bread that was kneaded with milk or meat, which is forbidden to be eaten with exception to circumstances explained above. Another Halachic issue involved in baking the two together, irrelevant of the concept of spillage, is the concept of smell. Initially we rule that the smell of a food penetrates taste into another food. Thus, if bread received the smell of meat or cheese we rule it may not initially be eaten with the opposite food. Another issue is the issue of Zeiah [vapor]. The vapor of a food is considered like the food itself. Hence, if the vapor of meat or cheese enters the bread this gives this bread the same status of bread that was kneaded with milk or meat, which is forbidden to be eaten with exception to circumstances explained above. The issue is especially relevant when cooking in modern day ovens in which the ceiling of the oven receives all the vapor of the foods.

A. Lechatchilah:

Uncovered: It is forbidden to bake bread at the same time that that one is baking [uncovered] meat or cheese [unless one of the above-mentioned conditions of shape or amount are fulfilled].[63] [It is initially forbidden to do so even if the oven is wide and flat[64] and even if the meat/cheese and bread are not on the same surface.[65] This prohibition applies to both modern and medieval ovens.]

If the meat or milk or bread is covered:[66] If the meat or cheese is covered [and the oven is clean of any meat or dairy residue and is not Ben Yomo[67], and there is no suspicion that the meat or cheese will overflow onto the bread[68]] then it is permitted [even Lechatchilah[69]] to bake bread together with the meat or dairy food, and the bread is considered Pareve and may be eaten with the opposite food. [If, however, only the bread was covered, then although in medieval ovens it would be allowed to bake it simultaneously with uncovered meat/cheese, in modern ovens this would need to be avoided due to the issue of Zeiah. Likewise, even if the meat or cheese is covered, if the oven contains residue of meat or cheese, it is forbidden, due to the smell and vapor of that residue. Residue of an oven can only be cleaned through preheating the oven for some time and burning any residue substance, as explained in the next Halacha.]

B. Bedieved if baked together uncovered:[70]

If one baked uncovered bread and meat or milk simultaneously under the same roofing then it is forbidden to eat the bread together with the opposite food, [due to the vapor of meat or milk that it has received]. [Accordingly, if the bread does not have a specific shape and is enough to last for more than one day, then even the bread itself is forbidden.[71] Thus, being that modern ovens today have an issue of vapor, it is forbidden to bake bread at the same time as uncovered meat or dairy, and if one does so it follows the same laws as bread that was kneaded with meat/milk, in which case the bread is forbidden unless it contains a special shape or small amount.[72]]

Summary and Final Ruling:

One may not bake bread with a meat or dairy food simultaneously in the same oven unless one of the following conditions are fulfilled:

1. The bread will only last for one day and one does not plan to eat it with the opposite food. Thus, if one bakes it with dairy, he does not plan to eat the bread with meat.

2. The bread has a specific shape which reminds one of its dairy or meat status.

3. The meat or cheese is covered, and the oven is clean [and not Ben Yomo]. In such a case, the bread remains Pareve and it is permitted to eat the bread with either meat or dairy.

Bedieved if one did not fulfill the above conditions: If one did not fulfill the above conditions and baked bread simultaneously with cheese/meat then the bread is forbidden to be eaten at all.

 

Q&A

Example-May one bake Challah for Shabbos at the same time that he is baking meat or chicken?

If the meat or chicken is covered, it is allowed to be done if the oven is clean of any meat or chicken residue. If they are both uncovered, it is only permitted to do so if one will not eat the bread with dairy and is only baking enough to last that Shabbos, or is forming the Challah in a special shape that reminds him of its meat status. If one transgressed and baked them together without fulfilling the above conditions, then by today’s ovens that have a close roofing, the bread is forbidden, just as if it were kneaded with meat.[73]

 

4. Baking Challah/bread/pastries in a meat or dairy oven:

Meat residue in oven:[74] One may not bake bread on a surface that contains meat residue. If one transgressed and did so, then the bread receives the same law as bread that was kneaded with milk/meat [in which case we rule that the bread is forbidden to be eaten[75]].

How to clean an oven of residue:[76] A meat [or dairy] oven must be cleaned of residue prior to baking bread inside of it, as explained above. The only way a proper cleaning can be accomplished is through performing Libun [even Kal] inside of the oven. [This can be accomplished by turning the oven on to a hot temperature and having it burn out any leftover residue.[77]] It does not suffice to merely clean the oven with a sponge and water, without also turning it on and burning any leftover residue that is inside.[78]

No meat residue in oven:[79] If one preheats the oven, thus burning any meat/dairy residue that it may contain, then one may bake the Challahs in the oven even though it was previously used to bake meat/dairy.[80] In such a case the Challahs remain Pareve.[81] Some Poskim[82] rule that this applies even if the oven is Ben Yomo of meat/dairy use at the time of the baking.[83] However, other Poskim[84] rule that one may never bake bread in a meat or milk oven which is Ben Yomo and if one did so, then one may not eat the food together with the opposite food but may eat it before or afterwards.[85] Practically, one is to be stringent like this approach if possible and wait 24 hours from meat use prior to baking bread[86], however, in a time of need one may suffice with turning on the oven for 15 minutes and “Koshering” its walls from its Ben Yomo use, and then bake Pareve Challahs in the meat oven.[87]

Summary:

If one desires to bake Pareve Challahs in a meat/dairy oven, the following conditions are to be fulfilled:

1. The oven is clean of residue through preheating the oven. [It is forbidden to bake Challahs in it otherwise, unless they have a special shape or are a small amount and will not eat with opposite food.]

2. The oven is not Ben Yomo from meat/dairy. Or, the oven is Ben Yomo, but one relies on the preheating of the oven to Kosher its walls.

5. Bread which touched meat or milk:[88]

One is to beware that bread does not come into contact with meat[89] or cheese [if he plans to eat the bread during other meals[90]]. If the bread came into contact with cheese or meat [that is moist[91]] then it is forbidden to eat it with the opposite food [i.e. if came in contact with meat do not eat the bread with dairy, and if it came in contact with cheese then do not eat the bread with meat].[92] [One is hence to make a sign on the bread to indicate its meat or dairy status.[93] However, if one washes the bread after it contacts the meat or cheese, then some Poskim[94] rule that it is permitted to be eaten with the opposite food. Alternatively, one can remove a peels worth of the bread from the area of contact.[95] The above, only applies if the bread and meat or cheese are moist. If, however, both the cheese or meat and bread are dry it is permitted to eat the bread with the opposite food even without washing the bread in between.[96] However, some Poskim[97] rule that regarding cheese, if it comes in contact with bread, the bread always becomes dairy even if the cheese and bread were dry.]

Q&A

If meat gravy spilled on a loaf of bread, may it be used to eat with dairy?[98]

No. It does not suffice to wash or even peel the bread in such a case.

May one place vegetables in the same bag as meat, poultry, or cheese?

If one is accustomed to wash the vegetables prior to their use, he may do so even if the vegetables will come in direct contact with the meat or cheese. If one is not always accustomed to wash the vegetables, then one may not initially do so if he plans to use the vegetables for the opposite foods [i.e. don’t place tomatoes in a bag with dripping meat if you plan on using the tomatoes for pizza].

May one place pastries in the same bag as meat or cheese?

One may not place pastries in the same bag as meat or cheese if they will come in direct contact with each other, as it is not common to wash pastries and one may come to eat the pastries with the opposite food. This applies even if one plans to rinse the pastries prior to eating them.

6. Using the same bread for meat and dairy foods:[99]

Two people who are eating, one meat and the other dairy, may not share the same bread.[100] [This applies even if they are eating on two separate tables, and do not know each other.[101] If, however, they clean their hands prior to touching the bread and use a Pareve knife then it is allowed.[102]]

Cleaning the table from the bread of the previous meal:[103] Prior to eating meat on a table used to eat dairy, one must remove from the table any leftover bread which was used to eat with the cheese. The same applies vice versa.

 

 Q&A

May one eat leftover bread from a meat meal for a dairy meal?[104]

One may not use a piece of leftover bread which he ate during a meat meal for a dairy meal. However, the remaining pieces from the loaf which one never used for meat may be used for dairy even if they were on the meat table, so long as they did not come into contact with meat and were not cut with a meat knife. Nevertheless, it is a Mitzvah Min Hamuvchar to not use any of the items that were on a meat table for milk. [Thus, if one desires to keep bread Pareve he is not to place it directly on a dairy or meat area and is to cut it with a Pareve knife. If the bread is in a bag it may be placed on a meat table, although care should be taken when removing bread to not get food on the remaining pieces. Practically, experience shows that people are not always careful in the above and enter their dirty hands into the loaves, thus dirtying the bread with the foods on their hand, and it is thus best to avoid using the same bread of meat and dairy.]

_______________________________________

[1] 97:1

[2] Michaber 97:1

The reason: This decree is due to fear that perhaps the bread will be eaten together with the opposite food. [Michaber ibid]

[3] P”M 97 S.D. 1; Aruch Hashulchan 97:3; Zivcheiy Tzedek 97:1; Kaf Hachaim 97:1

The reason: Although poultry and wild animal meat is a Rabbinical form of Basar Bechalav with milk, and hence decreeing against making bread with such gravy would be a decree upon a decree, nevertheless, in this case the Sages made the decree. The reason for this is because bread is the most common staple of a meal and gets eaten with meat and milk. [Poskim ibid] To note, that in truth there are three decrees involved here; a) One may come to eat the bread with the opposite food; b) A decree against Rabbinical meats; c) A decree against meat and milk being eaten together even not Derech Bishul.

[4] Michaber 97:1

[5] However, prior to it being baked, one may shape it and hence allow the bread to be eaten, as explained in the exceptions to be listed

[6] Peri Toar 97:3; Kaf Hachaim 97:21; See Q&A regarding Lechatchilah!

[7] The reason: This is due to a decree that one may come to eat it with the opposite food. [Shach 97:1; Chavas Daas 97:3; P”M 97 S.D. 1; Aruch Hashulchan 97:1; Kaf Hachaim 97:1]

[8] Peri Megadim 97 S.D. 1 that so is implied from Setimas Haposkim, although concludes with Tzaruch Iyun; Pischeiy Teshuvah 97:2; Aruch Hashulchan 97:8 that without doubt even Shogeg is forbidden as the Sages did not differentiate; Kaf Hachaim 97:11 concludes that in such a case one may be lenient to place a Siman on the bread and sell or distribute the bread to many people so it be eaten in one day.

[9] 97:1

[10] Aruch Hashulchan 97:4; Kaf Hachaim 97:8; If the entire household can finish the bread by the end of the meal or day then it is considered a small amount. However, other families cannot be taken into account for this amount.

[11] Michaber 97:1

[12] Implication of Michaber ibid as understood by P”M 97 S.D. 1, Aruch Hashulchan 97:4; Yad Yehuda Katzar 97:6; Kaf Hachaim 97:7 that so is the ruling for Sephardim

[13] Rama in Toras Chatas 60:2 [The Rama in Toras Chatas ibid rules that one may bake enough dairy or meaty bread to last one day’s worth. Thus, the Rama argues on the Michaber who only allows to bake one meals worth. A proof that this is the Rama’s opinion in the Shulchan Aruch can be seem from his ruling that one may bake dairy bread for Shavuos even though there is more than one meal eaten on Shavuos.]; Peri Megadim 97 S.D. 1 in name of Toras Chatas ibid; Chavas Daas 97:4 and Biurim 3; Aruch Hashulchan 97:4; Kaf Hachaim 97:7 in opinion of Rama and ruling for Ashkenazim

[14] Kaf Hachaim 97:7

[15] Rama ibid

[16] Bach 97; Beis Lechem Yehuda 97:3; Kaf Hachaim 97:24

[17] Michaber ibid

[18] Chavas Daas 97:5; Pischeiy Teshuvah 97:3; Binas Adam in Shaar Issur Viheter 51; Darkei Teshuvah 97:21; Zivcheiy Tzedek 97:13; Kaf Hachaim 97:14

The reason: As the bread has already become forbidden due to the lack of shape at the time of baking. [Poskim ibid]

Other opinions: Some Poskim rule one may carve the word “Milk” on the bread even after it is baked. [Das Eish 12 brought in Darkei Teshuvah ibid] Other Poskim rule that in a case of great loss one may place labels on the bread. [Hakashrus 10 footnote 33]

[19] Darkei Teshuvah ibid

[20] Rama ibid; Peri Chadash 97:2; Shulchan Gavoa 97:8; Kaf Hachaim 97:23 that so is implied from the Talmud that they would bake bread with fat in honor of Shabbos

[21] P”M 242 M”Z 1

[22] Kaf Hachaim 97:25

[23] Rama ibid

[24] Peri Toar 97:3; Kaf Hachaim 97:21

[25] The reason: As this is a case of Sfek Sfeika, as perhaps the gentile will not sell it to a Jew, and even if he does, perhaps the Jew will not eat it with the opposite food. [Poskim ibid]

[26] Rav Poalim 1:11; See also Hakashrus 10:16

[27] Erech Hashulchan 97:4; Mordechai; Kaf Hachaim 97:17

[28] Admur 494:16; See Pnei Aryeh 48; Pischeiy Teshuvah 97:4; Kaf Hachaim 97:28

[29] The reason: As this is a classical case of Nat Bar Nat. [Poskim ibid]

[30] Pnei Aryeh 48; Pischeiy Teshuvah 97:4; Kaf Hachaim 97:28

[31] See Chapter 95 Halacha 1 regarding Nat Bar Nat of foods

[32] See Kaf Hachaim 97:12-13 and 15; Hakashrus 10:15

[33] So is evident from Rama 98:1 who discusses the allowance of the Pashtida and Pladin; All Poskim in coming footnotes

[34] Birkeiy Yosef 97 Shiyurei Bracha 1; Zivcheiy Tzedek 97:8; Kaf Hachaim 97:13

[35] Maharamit Y.D. 18; Kneses Hagedola 97:5; Peri Chadash 97:1; Lechem Hapanim 97:1; Beis Lechem Yehuda 97:2; Mizmor Ledavid 97; Shulchan Gavoa 2; Chochmas Adam 50:3; Pischeiy Teshuvah 97:3; Aruch Hashulchan 97:7; Zivcheiy Tzedek 97:11; Kaf Hachaim 97:12 and 15

[36] See Birkeiy Yosef 97 Shiyurei Bracha 1 and Kaf Hachaim 97:16 that in Turkey and Eretz Yisrael where they make meat Burekas, the dairy pastries are to be made with a Shinuiy

[37] Taz 97:1; Kneses Hagedola 97:2; Peri Toar 97:1; Beis Lechem Yehuda 97:1; P”M 97 M.Z. 1; Erech Hashulchan 97:2;

[38] The reason: As spices are commonly used for meat and dairy foods, and if we allow it to be continued to be used, one may come to use it for the opposite food. This is similar to the decree of the Sages to prohibit kneading bread with meat or milk due to worry, and if one doe so the bread is forbidden. [Poskim ibid]

[39] Tzemach Tzedek [Kadmon] 80; Minchas Yaakov 60:1; Kreisi 97:1; P”M 97 M.Z. 1; Erech Hashulchan 97:1; Zivcheiy Tzedek 97:4; Kaf Hachaim 97:5

[40] Peri Chadash 97:1; Minchas Yaakov 60:3 [however see previous footnote regarding wine]; Lechem Hapanim 97:1; Chavas Daas 97:1; Shulchan Gavoa 97:3; Birkeiy Yosef 97 Shiyurei Bracha 3; Chochmas Adam 50:7; Aruch Hashulchan 97:2;  Kaf Hachaim 97:2 [however see previous footnote regarding wine]

[41] The reason: As even if there is room to suspect that the spice may get eaten with the opposite food, we cannot create new decrees on our own, and the Sages only made their decree regarding bread which is the staple of a meal, and not with other foods. [Peri Chadash ibid]

[42] Peri Chadash 97:3; Lechem Hapanim 97:4; Beis Lechem Yehuda 97:4; P”M 97 S.D. 1; Aruch Hashulchan 97:3; Zivcheiy Tzedek 97:10; Kaf Hachaim 97:1

[43] The reason: As since the meat or milk is recognizable, there is no chance that one may come to stumble and eat it with the opposite food.

[44] See Hakashrus chapter 10

[45] Maharamit Y.D. 18; Kneses Hagedola 97:4; Peri Chadash 97:1; Peri Toar 97:2; Minchas Yaakov 60:4; Beis Lechem Yehuda 97:4; Chavas Daas 97:5; Chochmas Adam 50:3; Pischeiy Teshuvah 97:3; Beis Yitzchak 97:4; Aruch Hashulchan 97:7; Kaf Hachaim 97:12

[46] The reason: As only the actual baker and his family understand the meaning of the shapes. However, the public is unaware of the meaning of the shape and may come to eat it with the opposite food. [Poskim ibid]

[47] Peri Toar ibid; Kaf Hachaim ibid

[48] Mizmor Ledavid 97; Kaf Hachaim 97:12

[49] Maharamit Y.D. 18; Kneses Hagedola 97:1; Peri Chadash 97:1; Beis Lechem Yehuda 97:2; Kreisi 97:4; Birkeiy Yosef 97 Shiyurei Bracha 4; Chochmas Adam 50:4; Zivcheiy Tzedek 97:3; Sdei Chemed Basar Bechalav 8; Kaf Hachaim 97:4

Other opinions: Some Poskim suggest that even Bedieved the bread is forbidden as the Sages did not allow one to rely on tasting or 60x. [Kreisi 97:1, although concludes that one may rely on the Maharamit regarding 60x however not regarding tasting]

[50] Tzemach Tzedek [Kadmon] 80; Minchas Yaakov 60:1; Kreisi 97:1; P”M 97 M.Z. 1; Erech Hashulchan 97:1; Zivcheiy Tzedek 97:4; Kaf Hachaim 97:5

[51] Maharamit Y.D. 18; Kneses Hagedola 97:3; Kneses Hagedola Teshuvah 136 permits to even eat with opposite food; Birkeiy Yosef 97 Shiyurei Bracha 4; Chavas Daas 97 Biurim 2

[52] Kaf Hachaim 97:6

[53] See Darkei Teshuvah 97:21; Pischeiy Teshuvah 97:3

[54] Pischeiy Teshuvah 97:3; Peri Megadim 97 S.D 1; Chavas Daas 97; Kaf Hachaim 97:14

[55] Daas Eish 12 and Chamudei Daniel brought in Darkei Teshuvah 97:21

[56] Hakashrus 10 footnote 33 in name of Rav Moshe Halbershtam

[57] Darkei Teshuvah ibid

[58] Pleisy 97:1 in name of his grandfather, although he himself is stringent, as explained in next footnote

[59] Pleisi ibid rules one is not to rely on the allowance of his grandfather unless there is another reason for leniency; The following Poskim, however, completely negate the leniency: P”M 97 S.D 1; Chavas Daas 97:5; Levushei Serud Chidushei Dinim Y.D. 139; Pischeiy Teshuvah 97:3

[60] Chochmas Adam 50:5; Kaf Hachaim 97:9

[61] Kaf Hachaim 97:11

[62] Levushei Serud Chidushei Dinim Y.D. 41; Pischeiy Teshuvah 97:2; Kaf Hachaim 97:10

[63] Michaber/Rama 97:1

The reason: If the meat/cheese and bread are sitting on the same surface, then it is forbidden to do so due to worry that perhaps the meat or cheese will spill over into the bread and make the bread meaty or dairy. [Rama 97:1] Furthermore, even if they are not on the same surface it is  forbidden because the smell of the meat is initially considered to be meaty or cheesy and thus penetrates the bread. [Michaber 97:3; 108:1; Chavas Daas 97 Biurim 5; Aruch Hashulchan 97:11] Furthermore, in today’s ovens it is also forbidden due to the vapor released from the meat or milk. [See Rama 108:1]

[64] Shach 97:2; Peri Chadash 97:3; Lechem Hapanim 97:3; Beis Lechem yehuda 97:4; Kaf Hachaim 97:26

The reason: As we nevertheless suspect that the cheese or meat fat may drip onto the bread. [Poskim ibid]

[65] This is initially forbidden due to Reicha. [See Michaber 97:3; 108:1; Chavas Daas 97 Biurim 5; Aruch Hashulchan 97:11]

[66] Michaber 97:3

[67] See next Halacha!

[68] As otherwise it make no difference that the foods are covered as hot liquid penetrates fully into a food. Thus the entire idea of being covered mentioned in 97:3 is only with regards to avoiding the issue of smell “Reicha Milsa Hi” while regarding the issue of spillage it serves no benefit.

[69] Hakashrus Chapter 10

[70] Rama 108:1; See “A Semicha Aid for Learning the Laws of Taaruvos” Chapter 108 Halacha 2I and 3A for a full analysis of this subject!

The law by medieval ovens: If the bread was baked in a medieval oven [as opposed to modern ovens which pose an issue of Zeiah/vapor, and prohibits the bread completely unless it fulfills one of the conditions brought above.] then the bread is only permitted if a) The bread and meat/dairy were baked in pans. Or 2) The bread and meat/dairy were baked without pans, directly on the oven surface, although the surface was flat, or the bread was higher on the slant than the meat/cheese, and one did not notice any spillage. [See Rama 97:1; Shach 97:2]

[71] Shach 108:11; Chochmas Adam 62:6; Kreisy 108:12; Kaf Hachaim 108:33

Other Opinions: The Peri Chadash 108:10 argues on the Shach and rules the bread is permitted Bedieved even if it does not have a shape and is a large amount. The above Poskim negate his opinion; See the following Poskim who are lenient in certain cases even if the bread was actually kneaded with milk or meat: Kreisy Upleisy 97:1 in name of his grandfather; Daas Eish 12 and Chamudei Daniel brought in Darkei Teshuvah 97:21; Hakashrus 10 footnote 33 in name of Rav Moshe Halbershtam; Kreisy Upleisy 97:1 in name of his grandfather.

[72] See Chapter 4 Halacha 6 for the full details on the vapor issue with modern ovens today; Igros Moshe 1:40; See Darkei Halacha p. 242; Maharsham 3:208; Minchas Yitzchak 5:20; Kinyan Torah 1:24

[73] See Shach 108:11 or “A Semicha Aid for Learning the Laws of Taaruvos” chapter 108 Halacha 2I and 3A; Chochmas Adam 62:6; Kreisy 108:12; Kaf Hachaim 108:33; Igros Moshe 1:40; See Darkei Halacha p. 242; Maharsham 3:208; Minchas Yitzchak 5:20; Kinyan Torah 1:24

Opinions who are lenient: See Peri Chadash 108:10 who argues on the entire ruling of the Shach ibid which prohibits the bread; See the following Poskim who are lenient in certain cases even if the bread was actually kneaded with milk or meat: Kreisy Upleisy 97:1 in name of his grandfather; Daas Eish 12 and Chamudei Daniel brought in Darkei Teshuvah 97:21; Hakashrus 10 footnote 33 in name of Rav Moshe Halbershtam; Kreisy Upleisy 97:1 in name of his grandfather.

[74] Michaber 97:1 and 3

[75] Minchas Yaakov 60:1; Kaf Hachaim 97:18; This is referring to the bread baking of previous times in which the oven was often fueled with fat of the tail of an animal, and the bread would then be placed directly on the oven wall for baking. The same would apply today if one placed the pan on top of meat gravy and the like

[76] Michaber 97:2

[77] Kinyan Torah 1:24

[78] Taz 97:4; Peri Chadash 97:4; Chavas Daas 97:9; Aruch Hashulchan 97:12; Kaf Hachaim 97:34]

The reason: As the fat does not clean off well and requires the oven to be lit in order to burn the fat. [Poskim ibid]

[79] See Igros Moshe 1:40; Pischeiy Halacha p. 27; 157; Hakashrus 1:40; Kinyan Torah 1:24; Minchas Yitzchak 5:20 or “A Semicha Aid for Learning the Laws of Taaruvos” chapter 108 Halacha 2I and 3A

[80] Kinyan Torah ibid writes that one is to simply turn the oven on for some time prior to baking the Pareve food and this will verify that any leftover food in the oven has become destroyed.

[81] See Igros Moshe 1:40; Pischeiy Halacha p. 27; 157; Hakashrus 1:40

[82] Igros Moshe 1:40; All Poskim who rule Nat Bar Nat is even initially permitted

[83] The reason: As Challahs are dry and hence do not release vapor. [Igros Moshe ibid] This also follows those Poskim who rule that dry foods do not release a problematic vapor: Toras Chatas 35:6 [See Minchas Yaakov ibid]; Masas Moshe 4:30; P”M O.C. Hanhagos Horaos Issur Viheter Seder Sheiyni 37, brought in Pischeiy Teshuvah 92:6 that only liquids release vapor; Beis Meir 461; Poskim in Darkei Teshuvah 92:164; Igros Moshe 1:40 unless one sees that it released vapor; See Tzemach Tzedek ibid who brings the P”M but then negates his conclusion as being not substantive; See Admur 451:42 regarding a Chararah who states the pot requires Libun because it touches it most of the time, and does not mention the aspect of Zeiah [brought in Tur and Bach ibid], however seemingly, this is simply because Admur is explaining why it needs Libun, and not simply Hagala due to the vapor; Likewise, see Admur 447:9 who permits

[84] See Pischeiy Halacha p. 27; 157; Hakashrus 1:40; This follows the ruling of those Poskim who rule that Nat Bar Nat is initially forbidden. [See Rama 95:2; Chapter 4 Halacha 1];

Other opinions-Sephardic custom: According to the Sephardic custom, and the Poskim who rule that Nat Bar Nat is initially permitted, the bread remains Pareve even if the oven is Ben Yomo. [See Michaber 95:1]

[85] The reason: As according to most Poskim, even dry foods release vapor. [See Tur 451:15 regarding Charara “And it releases vapor”; Bach 451:13; M”A 451:30; Yad Yehuda 92 Aruch 53; Masas Binyamin 42:58; Chacham Tzvi 20; P”M 451 A.A. 30; Rivash 295; Tzemach Tzedek O.C. 43; Shoel Umeishiv Chamisha 4; Beis Shlomo Y.D. 1:162 and 164; Maharsham; Daas Sofer; Levushei Mordechai; Poskim in Darkei Teshuvah 92:164; Rav Elyashiv in Beis Yitzchak; See Peri Haretz Y.D. 2:14]

[86] It does not initially suffice to Kosher the oven before the 24 hours have passed through turning it on, as most modern oven walls are covered with enamel and require Libun Chamur. [See Admur 494:1 [and 461:1; 451:7 regarding Chametz] that an earthenware oven requires Libun Gamur to be Koshered from meat to milk and our oven interiors are plated with enamel which some Poskim rule have the same status as earthenware [Tuv Taam Vadaas Kama 183] However, if one has a self-cleaning oven, then it suffices for one to perform a self-cleaning cycle to clear it of its Ben Yomo status and bake Pareve bread.

[87] As some Poskim [See Piskeiy Teshuvos 451:49] rule that even enamel is Kosherable with Libun Kal, unlike earthenware, and here regarding Nat Bar Nat one may be lenient like their opinion.

[88] 91:3

[89] Raw meat that has not been salted for blood: One is certainly required to be careful not to allow bread to come into contact with meat that has not yet been salted for its blood, as one may come to eat this blood. If this occurred, one is to peel, or at least grate away, the area of contact. [Peri Toar 91:3; Zivcheiy Tzedek 91:14; Kaf Hachaim 91:17]

[90] Shaareiy Yoreh Deah 91

[91] Shach 91:4; Peri Chadash 91:4; Lechem Hapanim 91:7; Beis Lechem Yehuda 91:6; Kreisi 91:3; Chavas Daas 91:5; P”M 91 S.D. 4; Chochmas Adam 41:5; Beis Yitzchak 91:14; Aruch Hashulchan 91:5; Kaf Hachaim 91:15

[92] Michaber 91:3

[93] Yad Yehuda 4; Rav Poalim 11

[94] Shach 91:4; Peri Chadash 91:4; Lechem Hapanim 91:7; Kreisi 91:3; Chavas Daas 91:5; Chochmas Adam 41:5; Beis Yitzchak 91:14; Kaf Hachaim 91:16

Other opinions-Kelipa: Some Poskim rule it does not suffice to wash bread, and rather one must cut off the area of contact. [Kneses Hagedola 91:2; Peri Toar 91:3, brought in Kaf Hachaim 91:16; So rules Hakashrus 10:56]

Hard part of bread versus soft part: Some Poskim conclude that when the meat or cheese touches the hard part of the bread, such as its crusty part, then it suffices to wash it. However, if it touched the inner part of the bread which is soft, then it requires a Kelipa. [Pischeiy Teshuvah 91:4; Kaf Hachaim ibid]

[95] Peri Toar 91:3, brought in Kaf Hachaim 91:16

[96] Shach 91:4; Peri Chadash 91:4; Lechem Hapanim 91:7; Beis Lechem Yehuda 91:6; Kreisi 91:3; Chavas Daas 91:5; P”M 91 S.D. 4; Chochmas Adam 41:5; Beis Yitzchak 91:14; Aruch Hashulchan 91:5; Kaf Hachaim 91:15

[97] Kneses Hagedola 91:3, brought in P”M ibid and Kaf Hachaim ibid; See Peri Toar 91:4; Zechor Leavraham Y.D. 91:2; Zivcheiy Tzedek 91:2; Kaf Hachaim 91:2

[98] Zivcheiy Tzedek 91:13; Kaf Hachaim 91:16

[99] Rama 88:2

[100] The reason: As a) The bread gets dirty from the hands of each eater and b) one may not initially cut bread with a meat or dairy knife to eat with the opposite food. [See 89:4; Kaf Hachaim 88:28]

[101] Poskim ibid

[102] Aruch Hashulchan 88:11; Kaf Hachaim 88:28

[103] Michaber 89:4

[104] Igros Moshe Yoreh Deah 1:38; See Hakashrus 1:78-81

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