Fleishig eggs? Part 1

Fleishig eggs:

A. Hardboiled eggs cooked with meat:[1]

If an egg was cooked together with meat or poultry [i.e. Fleishig stew or Chulent] then the egg becomes Fleishig and it is forbidden to eat the egg with dairy. Furthermore, one must wait 6 hours after eating the egg prior to eating dairy.[2] This applies even if the egg was cooked within its shell.[3]

B. Hardboiled eggs cooked in meat pot with only Pareve:

Not Ben Yomo:[4]  If an egg was cooked in a [clean[5]] meat pot that was not Ben Yom [i.e. past 24 hours of cooking or soaking meat], then the egg remains Pareve and may even initially be eaten together with dairy products.[6] [However, some Poskim[7] rule that it is forbidden to initially cook Pareve food in a non-Ben Yomo meat pot with intent to eat the food with milk products, or vice versa. Other, Poskim[8], however, rule that it is permitted to do so even initially with intent to eat with the opposite food.[9] Practically, Sephardim may be lenient even initially[10], and Ashkenazim may be lenient in a time of need, such as if there is no other pot available.[11] According to all, if one already cooked the Pareve food in a non-Ben Yomo meat pot with intent to eat with milk, he may eat it with milk.[12] ]

Ben Yomo:[13] If an egg was cooked in a [clean[14]] meat pot that was Ben Yom [i.e. within 24 hours of cooking or soaking meat], then some Poskim[15] rule that the egg remains Pareve and is permitted to be eaten with milk products, even if the pot was Ben Yom, and so is the accustomed ruling for Sephardim.[16] [This applies even if the egg was peeled from its shell prior to being cooked, so long as the pot was not dirty.[17]] Other Poskim[18], however, rule that the egg is forbidden to be eaten with milk products[19] [although one is not required to wait six hours after eating it, prior to eating dairy[20]] and so is the accustomed ruling for Ashkenazim.[21] However, Bedieved, if one already cooked it with milk products, the mixture is permitted [even if the food does not contain 60x].[22]

C. Eggs found in a chicken after slaughtering:

Coming up part 2!

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[1] 95:2

[2] Rama 89:3; Beis Yosef O.C. 173; Peri Chadash 89:18; Kneses Hagedola 89:42; Lechem Hapanim 89:23; Birkeiy Yosef 89:30; Zivcheiy Tzedek 89:31; Kaf Hachaim 89:50, 52, 53, 55, 58

Other opinions: Some Poskim rule that one who ate meat gravy, but not actual meat, is not required to wait 6 hours prior to eating dairy. [Michaber 89:2] Practically, the final ruling and custom is unlike this opinion.

[3] Michaber 95:2

The reason: The reason for this is because egg shells contain pores which allows the meat taste to penetrate, as can be seen from the fact an egg changes colors when cooked in dye. [Beis Yosef 95 in name of Rashba; Taz 95:2] Alternatively, egg shells do not contain pores but nonetheless absorb being that their shell is thin and allows meat taste to penetrate and leave. [Taz 95:2 although in conclusion he does not disagree with the Rashba’s holy words.] See however, Michaber 86:5 that regarding Treif eggs we hold that the taste does not penetrate through the shell and prohibit other food.

[4] Rama 95:2

Other opinions: Some Poskim rule that initially one may not eat Pareve foods cooked in a non-Ben Yomo meat vessel together with milk. [Rashal Issur Viheter Shelo on Shaareiy Dura; Yam Shel Shlomo Kol Habasar 63, brought in Taz 95:4]

[5] Shach 95:2 Chavas Daas 95:3; P”M 95 S.D. 2; Zivcheiy Tzedek 95:16; Kaf Hachaim 95:18

[6] The reason: The reason for this is because the taste of the pot is considered spoiled and is Nat Bar Nat and thus we are lenient even initially.

[7] Devar Moshe Y.D. 9; Chochmas Adam 48:2

[8] Beis David Y.D. 42; Zivcheiy Tzedek 95:4; Kaf Hachaim 95:3

[9] The reason: As in such a case we have two reasons for leniency; 1) The pot is not Ben Yomo 2) The meat taste is Nat Bar Nat. [Kaf Hachaim ibid]

[10] Zivcheiy Tzedek ibid; Kaf Hachaim ibid; Hakashrus 1:36

[11] Chochmas Adam ibid; Koveitz Mibeis Levi 4:179-66; Hakashrus 1:36; 10:95; See Rama 89:3 and Shach there

[12] Peri Chadash 95:1; Lechem Hapanim 95:3; Kreisi 95:1; Kehilas Yehuda 95:1; Zivcheiy Tzedek 95:5; Kaf Hachaim 95:5

[13] 95:2

[14] Shach 95:2 Chavas Daas 95:3; P”M 95 S.D. 2; Zivcheiy Tzedek 95:16; Kaf Hachaim 95:18

[15] Michaber 95:1-2; ; Beis Yosef 95 in name of Rashba; Rambam Machalos Assuros 9:23; Rashi, brought in Tur 95:1 [unlike understanding of Rivan]; Rabbeinu Tam; Riy Hazakein; Sefer Hateruma 61, and Rosh Chulin Kol Habasar 29, brought in Tur ibid regarding cooking [as opposed to roasting]

According to the Michaber, may one initially cook Pareve foods in a meat vessel in order to eat with Milk? Even according to the Michaber, it is initially forbidden to cook Pareve food in a Ben Yomo meat pot with intention to eat that Pareve food with dairy products. [Admur 494:16; Shach 95:3; Taz 95:4; Rabbeinu Yerucham 15:28, brought [and negated] in Beis Yosef 95:1 in Bedek Habayis; Semak 213 and 198, brought in Beis Yosef ibid; Peri Chadash 95:1; Minchas Kohen 1:12; Lechem Hapanim 95:3; Beis Lechem Yehuda 95:3; Kreisi 95:1; Erech Hashulchan 95:5; Kehilas Yehuda 95:1; Zivcheiy Tzedek 95:2; Ben Ish Chaiy Korach 13; Kaf Hachaim 95:1 and 21 that the Michaber ibid retracted from his ruling in the Beis Yosef which was written before his Shulchan Aruch [see Yad Melachi 15; Chida in Shem Hagedolim Sefarim 75], and therefore the ruling in Michaber ibid is written in the form of Bedieved; Rav Shalom Mashash in Mizrach Shemesh 95 and Shemesh Umagen 1:8; 2:42] Thus, one may not heat water in a Ben Yomo meat pot for the sake of kneading dough, as one often eats bread with dairy. [Devar Moshe Y.D. 9; Shulchan Gavoa 1; Zivcheiy Tzedek 95:3; Kaf Hachaim 95:2] The same applies vice versa. However, some Poskim  rule that according to the Michaber it is permitted to even initially cook Pareve foods in Ben Yomo meat pot with intent to eat with dairy. [Beis Yosef 95:1 in Bedek Habayis, printed and his commentary on the Tur, writes that one may even initially cook in the Ben Yomo pot with intent to eat with the opposite food [However, the Poskim ibid say the Beis Yosef retracted this ruling in his Shulchan Aruch and rules that it is only allowed Bedieved.]; Maharah Even Tava in Shut Tashbatz Chut Hameshulash, Hatur Hasheleshi 33; Beis David 42; Pnei David Papau 2; Beis Yehuda 2:92; Yabia Omer 4:4; 94; Rav Yitzchak Yosef; See Hakashrus 1:35; 2:19] Even according to the first approach, if one already cooked the Pareve food in a Ben Yomo meat pot with intent to eat with dairy, he may go ahead and eat it with dairy. [Peri Chadash 95:1; Lechem Hapanim 95:3; Kreisi 95:1; Kehilas Yehuda 95:1; Zivcheiy Tzedek 95:5; Kaf Hachaim 95:5 unlike Minchas Kohen 1:12] 

[16] Kaf Hachaim 95:21

The reason and explanation: As this is a classic case of Nat Bar Nat Dihetera, similar to the fish case discussed in 95:1. [Beis Yosef ibid] The meat taste that the Pareve food contains has traveled from the meat to the pot and then from the pot to the Pareve food. This is called Nat Bar Nat Dihetera. The reason that this meat taste is not considered problematic with dairy is because the meat taste which the Pareve food absorbed from the Ben Yomo pot is so indirect and diluted that it does not have sufficient intensity to merge with milk and cause a fusion of Basar Bechalav. [Taz 95:1; Kneses Hagedola 95:24 in name of many Poskim; Peri Chadash 95:3; Lechem Hapanim 95:2; Chochmas Adam 48:17; Zivcheiy Tzedek 95:15; Kaf Hachaim 95:8]

[17] Shach 95:2 Chavas Daas 95:3; P”M 95 S.D. 2; Zivcheiy Tzedek 95:16; Kaf Hachaim 95:18

[18] Opinion in Rama 95:2; Rivan in name of Rashi; Issur Viheter Aruch Klal 34 [brought in Darkei Moshe 95:1]; Mordechai; Or Zarua; Rabbeinu Yerucham 15:28, brought in Beis Yosef [Bedek Habayis 95:1]; Shach 95:3; Peri Chadash 95:4; Lechem Hapanim 95:4; Beis Lechem Yehuda 95:3; Kreisi 95:4

[19] The reason: The reason for why the Rama is stringent is because the Rama rules Nat Bar Nat Dihetera is initially forbidden.

[20] Rama 89:3; Darkei Moshe 89:6; Beis Yosef O.C. 173; Shach 89:19

[21]

[22] Rama ibid; Semak; Aruch; Taz 95:4 that one who is lenient like the Rama has not lost out; Admur 494:16 [that we only suspect for Nat Bar Nat Lechatchilah]; Peri Chadash 95:5; Lechem Hapanim 95:6

Other opinions: Some Poskim rule that Pareve food which was roasted in a Ben Yomo meat pot, is forbidden to be eaten with milk products and even Bedieved the mixture is forbidden unless there is 60x versus in the milk versus the food. [Rashal Issur Viheter Shelo on Shaareiy Dura; Yam Shel Shlomo Kol Habasar 63, brought in Shach 95:4; Beis Lechem Yehuda 95:4 in name of Poskim; Kaf Hachaim 95:22 concludes that one who is stringent like the Rashal in a case that does not involve a great loss, is blessed.] The above Poskim are only stringent regarding a roasted food. However, a food that is cooked in liquid inside of a meat pot, or a food that is roasted in a meat pot that is Ben Yomo from meat that was cooked in liquid, is permitted Bedieved if it became mixed with dairy. [Chavas Daas 95:5; Pischeiy Teshuvah 95:4; Kaf Hachaim 95:2]